PWM for AT89C5115 (need informations)

It took me considerably longer to read and understand his post than it would have without the SMS. English is my first language, I read it quickly without having to think about the meaning of the words. When it is riddled with SMS, however, I frequently have to stop and mentally translate the abbreviations before I can make sense of it. If English were not my first language I doubt I'd be able to make sense of it at all.

Perhaps that's the flaw in my thinking. I assume that since I can scan through it at the same rate as standard English, then everyone else can as well. Also, I think the claim about non-native English speakers having more difficulty with SMS abbreviations is dubious. I would wager that swapna has a high probability of falling into that category himself (based solely on his name), but he seems to find it easier.

My guess is that as internet and other forms of text based communications between continents become commonplace, these abbreviations will become a part of the worldwide English that people use. Think of it as a sort of Esperanto for people who don't want to wear out their thumbs using their blackberry. :)

Of course. The essential difference, though, is that grammatical errors are unintentional, whereas use of SMS is a conscious decision. That is why nobody wastes time correcting them. You'll notice that some posters don't have a very good grasp of English - nobody criticises them either. In fact, I make a lot of effort to try to understand broken English.

I'm not sure this sort of unintentional mistake is somehow more benign. For isntance, plenty of people don't know the appropriate situations to use your or you're. They never learned it, and they just choose whichever they like when they feel like it. Someone who KNOWS that they don't know it well enough, however, might just use "ur" in both situations knowing that they'll be conveying their intent clearly enough in either case. I guess I just find the former more irritating. "To each his own" I suppose.

It took me considerably longer to read and understand his post than it would have without the SMS. English is my first language, I read it quickly without having to think about the meaning of the words. When it is riddled with SMS, however, I frequently have to stop and mentally translate the abbreviations before I can make sense of it. If English were not my first language I doubt I'd be able to make sense of it at all.

Perhaps that's the flaw in my thinking. I assume that since I can scan through it at the same rate as standard English, then everyone else can as well. Also, I think the claim about non-native English speakers having more difficulty with SMS abbreviations is dubious. I would wager that swapna has a high probability of falling into that category himself (based solely on his name), but he seems to find it easier.

My guess is that as internet and other forms of text based communications between continents become commonplace, these abbreviations will become a part of the worldwide English that people use. Think of it as a sort of Esperanto for people who don't want to wear out their thumbs using their blackberry. :)

Of course. The essential difference, though, is that grammatical errors are unintentional, whereas use of SMS is a conscious decision. That is why nobody wastes time correcting them. You'll notice that some posters don't have a very good grasp of English - nobody criticises them either. In fact, I make a lot of effort to try to understand broken English.

I'm not sure this sort of unintentional mistake is somehow more benign. For isntance, plenty of people don't know the appropriate situations to use your or you're. They never learned it, and they just choose whichever they like when they feel like it. Someone who KNOWS that they don't know it well enough, however, might just use "ur" in both situations knowing that they'll be conveying their intent clearly enough in either case. I guess I just find the former more irritating. "To each his own" I suppose.

Someone who KNOWS that they don't know it well enough, however, might just use "ur" in both situations knowing that they'll be conveying their intent clearly enough in either case.
Clearly???

How can microresistor be a clear representation of your?

It is NOT that I can not understand it, it IS that when I see $#|+ like this I have to stop and think, not about the problem the poster tries to describe, but about the word(s) (s)he uses.

I am not a "native english speaker" and I am sure that I make gramatical errors now and then, but for me (the "non-native english speaker") A gramattical error is not a problem in reading whereas "it is a 4gone tht Ur msg r a rply" will take me an effort to read, thus often missing what the message is trying to convey.

I will, however agree that a post with 4 times "you" and one "u" should be considered a freudian slip and not an insult.

Erik

"Also, I think the claim about non-native English speakers having more difficulty with SMS abbreviations is dubious."

If the non-native speaker is familiar with SMS I agree, if not it's just another difficulty to deal with.

"My guess is that as internet and other forms of text based communications between continents become commonplace, these abbreviations will become a part of the worldwide English that people use."

I've seen a lot of discussion on Usenet about the reasons why adults, particularly those from the Indian sub-continent, use SMS abbreviations in normal written communication and the concensus seems to be that they do it because they think it is a 'kewl' thing they have copied from the British and Americans.

"I'm not sure this sort of unintentional mistake is somehow more benign. For isntance, plenty of people don't know the appropriate situations to use your or you're. They never learned it, and they just choose whichever they like when they feel like it. Someone who KNOWS that they don't know it well enough, however, might just use "ur" in both situations knowing that they'll be conveying their intent clearly enough in either case."

That's quite an elaborate justification for 'ur', but it can't be applied to any of the other bits of SMS speak I pulled out of that post (unless you can imagine 'you'reself' being a word):

u
urself
cud
wudnt
abt
wud
sum

'sum' instead of 'some' really is ridiculous. It doesn't just obfuscate the text, it changes the meaning.

That's quite an elaborate justification for 'ur', but it can't be applied to any of the other bits of SMS speak I pulled out of that post (unless you can imagine 'you'reself' being a word):

u
urself
cud
wudnt
abt
wud
sum

'sum' instead of 'some' really is ridiculous. It doesn't just obfuscate the text, it changes the meaning.

I wasn't really trying to justify just "ur," but the whole premise in general as not being as bad as people here make it out to be. On a case-by-case basis, I'm sure there are a great number of common SMS-style abbreviations that are utter nonsense when framed like that.

But if we want to look at them one at a time (and why not. . . I'll take a break from coding for a moment), "some" is a exception to English phonetic rules. Normally, placing an "e" at the end of a word would force the "hard" form of a vowel (that is, without the exception, "some" would rhyme with "Rome"). Instead, for some ungodly reason, it's pronunciation has mutated into a schwa sound. So, "sum" is probably a more justifiable spelling based on phonetics.

Anyhow... I don't want to start a big battle over this. I certainly won't continue the debate into other threads. It just seems like sometimes it's trivialities like the SMS debate that take up more room in the forums than actual technical questions and solutions.

It just seems like sometimes it's trivialities like the SMS debate that take up more room in the forums than actual technical questions and solutions.

You just proved my point. When you have to decipher the message, the words become the important part, not the message.

Erik

"So, "sum" is probably a more justifiable spelling based on phonetics."

Ok, I read a sentence and see the word 'sum' in a peculiar context. I stop, give it some thought and realise that the author meant 'some' but misspelled it because the words sound the same. I understand the sentence.

Next, a reader who doesn't know English too well reads the sentence. Hmm, what does this word 'sum' mean? He checks the dictionary. He re-reads the sentence. He knows what all the words mean but can make no sense of the sentence.

"Anyhow... I don't want to start a big battle over this."

Indeed, nor do I. This subject comes up over and over again on Usenet, the same arguments for and against are trotted out each time, but the conclusion is usually this:

If everybody posting to an English language forum makes their best effort to write comprehensible English then everybody benefits.

"It just seems like sometimes it's trivialities like the SMS debate that take up more room in the forums than actual technical questions and solutions."

I agree. That is why I usually just ignore posts with a lot of SMS in them. Which, of course, doesn't really help the poster.

Next, a reader who doesn't know English too well reads the sentence. Hmm, what does this word 'sum' mean? He checks the dictionary. He re-reads the sentence. He knows what all the words mean but can make no sense of the sentence.

Actually, he'll probably see that "sum" in the dictionary is a noun, whereas it's being used in a sentence as an adjective and he will remain unable to decipher the message, but for an entirely different reason. :)

Indeed, nor do I. This subject comes up over and over again on Usenet, the same arguments for and against are trotted out each time, but the conclusion is usually this:

If everybody posting to an English language forum makes their best effort to write comprehensible English then everybody benefits.

I don't spend much time on Usenet, so I wasn't aware that this was a re-hash. Anyhow... I can agree with your conclusion that people should make their best effort at proper English. I certainly have some of my own language pet peeves. I just thought I'd try and see what everyone thought the big deal was. Thanks for entertaining the debate.